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6:12 am
September 24, 2009
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moonshake
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| PTC Wolf | posts 29 |
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Hello All,
Looking to try one of the other race options this fall, seeing as the pinewood is so far away. Anyone have any pro/cons for these? I've heard some scary stories about both, that made me change my mind about running them last year.
Thanks
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1:22 pm
September 24, 2009
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MISS Emily
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We're doing the Raingutter regatta for the first time in several years next week– I'll let you know how it turns out.
Emily
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MISS Emily, Committee Chair and TDL Pack 103, Atlanta, GA **A proud Mother in Scouting Service along with MISS Kris, MISS Liberty, and MISS Shannon**
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2:06 pm
September 24, 2009
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SM Shawn
| | Green Bay, WI | |
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We have always done the PWD, but I would like to try the RR…I have mentioned that we could think about doing it an extra event…
All events with the kind of magnitude of PWD, or RR or Rockets has the makings for disaster…just plan, plan, plan…
RR? Have it outside or on a concrete floor….water may damage other surfaces. What are some of the horror stories that you have heard? I have heard the same for all 3…
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Husband of a Committee Chair, Father of a Scout, a Webelos and an anxious 4 year old, Pack Trainer of Pack 4363 & Scoutmaster of Troop 1363
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2:33 pm
September 24, 2009
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Scouter Jeff
| | Southern California | |
| PTC Boy Scout | posts 150 |
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We've done a few raingutter regattas, but never did a space derby (but I so wish we did).
As far as raingutter regattas go, here's what helped us:
- Plenty of "line judges" – to help watch for winners, straws touching sails, keeping the path of the boys walkng clear of spectators, etc.
- The boys can get pretty excited, especially the older boys - a "sailor's code of conduct" could be useful.
- Several raingutters – we found it best to have a pair of raingutters for each rank, although you can combine some ranks. But you don't want Tigers racing Webelos. And you don't want to have too long of lines waiting for their turn.
- Pre-test the raingutters – look for leaks, check for damage, etc. And bring tools to patch leaks when you are at the race (either pliers for metal or silicon for vinyl raingutters).
- Have plenty of mops to clean up after the race (and during, if needed).
- Make sure your space isn't too cramped – crowds gather around the raingutters, so you don't want to place two different races too close to each other. Give yourself room to do this.
One year we did a raingutter regatta at a park. When the races were done, they empited the water, towel-dried them, lined them with tin foil, and made large ice cream sundaes. We were out of town and missed this, so I didn't see how it went, but I heard everyone had a lot of fun.
Here's a site I found that seems to have some good info:
http://www.buckskin.org/Resour…..egatta.htm
It's been a while since I've been to one, so that's what I can remember. I hope this helps.
In Scouting,
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- Scouter Jeff
Assistant Scoutmaster, District Trainer
http://thetrainerscorner.wordpress.com/
Twitter: Scouter Jeff
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3:00 pm
September 24, 2009
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Scouter Jeff
| | Southern California | |
| PTC Boy Scout | posts 150 |
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I just remembered one other thing. One year we thought it would be a good idea to make the boats out of popsicle sticks and paper sails. The boys were to hot-glue them together at the day of the race, then immediately go and race their boats.
It was a terrible idea! No one bothered to try to race these popsicle stick boats beforehand (actually they came out looking more like the raft on the movie "Castaway"). The popsicle sticks absorbed water. They swole up and some of them actually started to hit the sides of the raingutters and stick. And when the boys blew on them, the nose of the water-laden boat would sink and they inched forward while the boys looked like they were hyperventilating. It was a disaster!
"Pre-hike the hike"!
In Scouting,
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- Scouter Jeff
Assistant Scoutmaster, District Trainer
http://thetrainerscorner.wordpress.com/
Twitter: Scouter Jeff
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5:30 pm
September 24, 2009
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ScouterSteve
| | San Diego Area | |
| PTC Tiger | posts 7 |
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Post edited 5:31 pm – September 24, 2009 by ScouterSteve
I completely agree with all of Jeff's points, but "Sailor's Code of Conduct" Made me snicker! (I was one…)
Scouter Jeff said:
- The boys can get pretty excited, especially the older boys - a "sailor's code of conduct" could be useful.
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Scouter Steve – Unit Commissioner – http://ReverentScout.com – Twitter: ReverentScout – "If every hour someone wasted protesting was used to serve others: there wouldn't be anything left to protest…"
-Just came to me one day |
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8:36 pm
September 24, 2009
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MISS Emily
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What's included in the Sailor's Code of Conduct?
We've decided to only do Den races with 1st, 2nd and 3rd for each den to make the event shorter.
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MISS Emily, Committee Chair and TDL Pack 103, Atlanta, GA **A proud Mother in Scouting Service along with MISS Kris, MISS Liberty, and MISS Shannon**
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10:13 pm
September 24, 2009
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sebastian
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I've only done Space Derby once, and it wasn't enjoyable. There were a number of problems.
1. Tried to use a mix of old and new kits. But some of the old kits didn't have rubber bands or had very old bands.
2. Some families read directions/did research and had soaked the rubber bands in glycerin and prestretched them. Many others had not (or had no functional rubber band – see #1).
The rockets with well prepped rubber bands went far. The others did not. Really did not. Like didn't even make it half way to the finish line.
Then we had rubber bands breaking. Instead of saying, too bad, you wound the rubber band too much, the guest starters (a commissioner and a council guy) started to change the rules to allow more scouts to keep racing longer.
This involved taking rubber bands from some scouts and handing giving them to other scouts to use. The end result was that the scouts who'd researched ended up in the middle of the pack, while scouts who were less prepared ended up winning with parts from other rockets. I don't know that more than one or two families left the event pleased with the outcomes. And in all honesty, much of the fault lie with the leadership for not making sure that each kit had workable rubber bands to start with.
If I were doing it again, I would make the instructions very clear, especially about who will wind the rocket and if there will be replacement rubber bands available. I would consider giving every scout an extra band (or two) ahead of time. I would make sure they understand that part of the strategy of the race is weighing how many winds to use (ie, faster rocket vs risk of breaking the rubber band). I might consider prepping an entire bag of bands in glycerin and having scouts draw them at race registration.
OR
I would say that this is a fun but non-competitive event. Everyone who does a race gets a sticker (maybe coded blue and red and white). If they get enough stickers, then they get a patch.
Our pack has Space Derby scheduled for November. I may find somewhere else I have to be that weekend. Different pack, different families, but this is just an easy race to have trouble with, in part because it is done less often. It would almost be worth having a leader's race the month before (maybe at the pack meeting where kits are given out) to work out the kinks. You could really play up the potential problems with over/under winding or bands that don't hold up.
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1:07 am
September 25, 2009
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Scouter Jeff
| | Southern California | |
| PTC Boy Scout | posts 150 |
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Post edited 1:09 am – September 25, 2009 by Scouter Jeff
emskuban said:
What's included in the Sailor's Code of Conduct?
I don't know – I just made that up when I was writing the forum post. But I can tell you what rule #1 should be 
In Scouting,
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- Scouter Jeff
Assistant Scoutmaster, District Trainer
http://thetrainerscorner.wordpress.com/
Twitter: Scouter Jeff
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5:27 am
September 26, 2009
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moonshake
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| PTC Wolf | posts 29 |
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Post edited 5:38 am – September 26, 2009 by moonshake
Thanks for all the tips and anecdotes. Very helpful. The general vibe seems to support the Raingutter over the Space Derby, so that's the call I will make… and will announce it at the next meeting.
When I was considering these for last year, I thought the boats would be the easiest to work with, since it seems like the rockets require more finesse to put together. Then a neighboring Pack told me about their raingutter, which was probably their worst meeting of the year.
Instead of raingutters, they took a 6-inch diamater pvc pipe and split it lengthwise and capped the ends. Their "gutters" leaked very badly and made a mess… and the contour of the pipe made the boats get stuck (probably avoidable by using proper raingutters). And the last issue was range of physical capacity of the boys.
I think I could avoid their problems with many of your suggestions… going outside, and pre-testing the course. But I don't see anyway of avoiding the size mismatch, since our pack is pretty small. I think my only solution is to play up the "finishing the race/participation" as the goal, instead of who is faster than who.
The concerns of the Space Derby for me came from the Technical side of it. I imagine most families not taking the "speed tips". Like sanding the shell as thin as possible… or coating/painting the inside of the rocket so that the band unwinds with less resistence. I could make these suggestions to all, but only a couple will do it, and we can pretty much determine the race result ahead of time. Other things like the breaking bands… and the co-ordination of the little fingers winding… going to get some props slipping and stinging some pointer fingers.
One more question for the RR folks… is using straws easier for the boys? Most pics I've seen of the RR in action do not show people using straws.
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5:50 pm
September 26, 2009
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ArvadaScout
| | Arvada, CO | |
| PTC Boy Scout | posts 174 |
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Skip ther straws. The kids get a lot closer to their boats if they don't have straws. Plus, the pictures look a lot better.
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Steve Waltz — District Commissioner, Gateway District, Denver Area Council
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3:16 am
October 28, 2009
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moonshake
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| PTC Wolf | posts 29 |
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Post update. Just had our Regatta pack meeting tonight, and it went well… though there were some lessons learned.
You gotta do this in the summer and outside. I used vinyl u-lock style gutters and sealed them well. Using the tips on this post, i leak tested them ahead of time, and they were airtight. We just sat them up on a table and they worked well. Had to really fill them close to the brim to keep the boats up, which made for lots of dribbling over the edges.
Getting the water out was rough. I used a siphon hose to get most of it out… then when we thought it was low enough to carry to the sink, we picked them up and they twisted and spilled. We had a pirate theme going for the evening, so needless to say… several of us were swabbing the deck after the meeting.
You gotta round out the hulls. Most of the boys had major issue with the boats tipping, but the ones that were the most stable were the boats with their hulls sanded into a U-shape.
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8:54 am
November 10, 2009
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mbeyke
| | Carterville, IL. | |
| PTC Bear | posts 50 |
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Our pack has a four lane SD 'track' and try to do SD every other year. The trick is to have extra rubberbands, and the same leaders wind all the rockets the same number of turns. We have a couple of cordless screwdrivers with a winding tool attached to do the winding. We have done this as a summer day activity and made and raced the rockets all in one afternoon. Potato peelers work best for shaping the rocket, and craft paint or sharpies for decorating them.
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God Bless,
Mark L. Beyke
"Preach the Gospel at all times. If necessary, use words!" St. Francis of Assisi
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9:39 am
December 2, 2009
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smwalker_oh
| | Middletown, Ohio | |
| PTC Star Scout | posts 524 |
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We did a RR in the summer of '08 and a SD this past summer. Both of them the boys had fun, which is the key point to make. But we didn't run them with as much pomp and circumstance or formality as the PWD.
The space derby was interesting because not one ship made it all the way to the finish line the entire time. Some barely went 5 feet, others went further. The best one made it within 2 feet of the finish line but that was it. The boys all had fun and we had several race against me (the brick, I took the block out of the box and used it as-is) so they won at least one time, so they enjoyed it. That was kind of our "lessons learned" event, the guy who ran it took lots of notes and he's ready to try it again and thinks we'll do much better.
The raingutter regatta was likewise a "lessons learned" event. Most of what was posted above about having judges, etc. is true. Definitely hold this event outside and in warm weather if possible, because it is an EXCELLENT excuse to have a water fight at the end. Even if their ship didn't perform well, once they're all getting soaked (and soaking the leaders) they'll forget all about it.
Since we do them in the summertime the attendance is much lower and we will likely continue to do that so there isn't as much of a big deal to it and more of a fun time. I enjoyed doing both probably more than the PWD honestly because it was less about building the perfect spaceship or boat that will win all its races and more about just having a good time with the boys.
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Scott Walker,nCC/WDL/PT, Pack 19 Middletown | CR, Pack & Troop 801 Middletown | Hopewell District Cub Roundtable Commissioner | Dan Beard Council Certified Trainer
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